Mail.Liberal-Judaism

• shtiebl@juno.com (Brent A Sims)

• Robin Cohen Anderson <robin@crocker.com>
• Sherwin Rubin <sbrubin@airmail.net>
• David Howard <EditOnline@aol.com>
• Lewis Reich <lbr@sprynet.com>
• Jerry Blaz <ffdog@earthlink.net>
• Ruth Levenstein <RuthEllenL@aol.com>

• Lawrence Raphael <raphael@is3.nyu.edu>

From: shtiebl@juno.com (Brent A Sims)
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 11:59:45 EST
Subject: Authentic Judaism

I wasn't sure that I belonged on this mailing list, at least not until I read
Rabbi Wallach's thought provoking submission.

If the annuals of mainstream Jewish scholarship teach us anything, it is that
there are no absolutes. Much to the credit of those responsible for its
creation, the Talmud itself contains the opinions of differing schools of
Jewish thought. Although I don't claim to be a Talmudic scholar, I like to
think that the Rabbis intention was to let the rest of us know that authentic
Judaism can only be found in the eyes of the beholder. And, more importantly
perhaps, that the true essence of authentic Judaism just might be found
somewhere in between those conflicting schools of thought - that it can be
different for each and ever one of us.

If I may take the liberty: If the G-d of the Torah does indeed exist, then
that G-d would have the power to make each of us believe as the other does.
Assuming that this G-d does indeed exist, then the fact that we have been
blessed with the freedom of choice needs to be taken into consideration. Thus,
the most authentic of all Jews may very well be those few Jews who are willing
to listen and to learn from the many differing schools of Jewish thought.

As simplistic as this may sound, maybe that was the point that the Jewish
Sages were trying to make clear when they chose to include the story in the
Torah of how Jacob came to be known as Israel (Genesis 32:25-29).

Shalom Aleichem,
Brent Sims

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From: Robin Cohen Anderson <robin@crocker.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 09:48:25 GMT
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

In "Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?", Yaakov Menken wrote:

>In order to explain why "Messianic Judaism" is invalid without falling prey
>to claims of unfair treatment, I feel Reform must also define _positive_
>parameters. Robin Cohen Anderson wrote: "Any Reform Jews out there can
>correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel fairly certain that Reform Jews do not
>believe..." But a statement of what Reform does _not_ believe isn't enough
>and Rabbi Warshawsky does no better.

Now it's my turn to cry foul. Rav Menken left out my _positive_definition
later in the article where I wrote:

>All branches of Judaism believe we are born with pure souls, and that God
>accepts our imperfections, so long as we make a sincere effort to overcome
>them. What this effort actually *consists* of is the point of contention; the
>underlying assumptions are not points of conflict.

I might also add that Reform Judaism teaches that God is incorporeal and
indivisible. Any Reform rabbis out there can correct me if I'm wrong. This in
itself sets it apart from any form of Christianity (and I don't consider
Unitarian Universalism to be Christianity).

If we are simply talking about a way to deny MJs a place in Judaism, I believe
that stating these simple principles goes a long way. Most Christian
missionaries are not even aware that these core principles are central to all
forms of Judaism. One cannot simultaneously hold them and subscribe to the
belief that a man is God and that a blood sacrifice is required as atonement
for sin.

Perhaps these principles are so inherent in the nature of our beliefs that
we've forgotten to articulate them. Perhaps they are so simple that we are
wary of basing our arguments on them. I'm not sure. However, they are
currently the basis on which I reject any attempt to convince me that I am
stained with sin and require the blood of Jesus to save me. I could argue
chapter and verse with missionaries, but why bother when the core principles
of Judaism are completely at odds with the Christian paradigm?

B'shalom, 
Robin Anderson

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From: Sherwin Rubin <sbrubin@airmail.net>
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 10:19:37 -0800
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

So many words about J4J's and so little light.  Yaacov Menkin, in v109,
addresses the crux of the question which is education.

There is only one problem that Jews have with the self proclaimed "Jews" of
the mesianic cults. We fear that they will ensnare our own children.  The
problem is that we have failed to educate our children with the tools that
would protect them from being exploited by people who's ideas are not
acceptable to us.

Jews feel an obligation to pass on the core beliefs of the religion simply
because our ancestors gave so much to pass the faith to us.  This can be done
by education in the home for young children and then in suitable schools for
them as they mature.  There seems to be some agreement that in America, our
efforts are not getting the job done.

Yaacov says, "Torah-observant" Judaism has a clear set of beliefs."  My
traditional friends fault more liberal Jews when they say that the Orthodox
have a "package" to hand down to their children unchanged from generation to
generation.  The problem in America is that the "package" is seldom opened
like the Chumash given to children at their Bar/Bat Mitzzvah.

Posters to the thread "Orthodox Knowledge of History," cite the exclusion of
modern thinkers starting with Baruch Spinoza and Moses Mendelsohn as a gap in
Orthodox teaching.  When European Jews living in fenced ghettos built a fence
around the Torah they felt safer by excluding those teachings of Judaism that
showed its intelectual superiority to Christianity or Islam.  This fence
included the Chumash, but left beautiful and inspiring portions of the Tanach
ourside of classic courses of study.  This fence later excluded the modern
thinkers like Spinoza and Mendelshon and anyone associated with the
enlightenment movement called Haskalah.  The fence excluded the philosophy
necessary to appeal to modern Jews living in freedom among the other
religions.  It left our children starved for spirituality and left them prey
to the evangelism of the messianic Jews.

Like Christianity in its early days, modern Judaism needs to do a marketing
study to find what will sell.  We need to search for the strengths and
weaknesses of our religion and to rediscover the truths necessary to inspire
our children and our fellow Jews.  The ability to change is the strength of
liberal Judaism.  If we concentrate on this strength, we have no need to worry
about MJ's, J4J's or any other J's, Christians or Moslems.

Sherwin Rubin
Arlington, Texas

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From: David Howard <EditOnline@aol.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 12:24:56 -0500
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

The quick barrage of responses to my post on Messianic Judaism confirms my
original suspicion that we're dealing here with an overheated issue in the
Jewish community. What's all the fuss? My basic contention is that Jewish
reaction to MJ has decidedly more to do with reverse discrimination, call it
Christianphobia, than with theology.

In this context I am delighted to read the frank and soul-searching responses
of both Yaakov Menken and Robin Cohen Anderson. Both recognize hostility
toward Christians in their own background. Menken is more inclined to defend
the attitude historically: "It has little to do with theology - we know that
our fathers and mothers were brutally murdered by acts of 'Christian love,'
yet died with the Shema on their lips. For their grandchildren to betray their
memory is like dancing on their graves"; while Cohen Anderson expresses shame:
"I'm afraid to say that this prejudice of mine is still dying a very slow and
grudging death." Both, however, bring our deep-seated negative feelings out of
the closet of denial and shed light on what I view as a key aspect of this
issue.

One of the common threads in the replies to my original post is what I'll call
the Conspiracy Theory of MJ. Can MJ be reduced to a devious fundamentalist
movement designed to theologically seduce and brainwash Jewish children? Aaron
Rittmaster claims:

> The reality is that Messianic Judaism was created and is supported and run,
> by fundamentalist Christian church organizations.  Messianic Judaism is, for
> them, an outreach program.  The largest supporters of Messianic Jewish
> groups in the United States is the Assemblies of God Pentacostal
> Church. They have even produced training 

This sounds like the kind of seduction/brainwashing explanation of "cults"
we've heard so often in the past, purportedly to explain why otherwise
"normal" people became Communists, Hindus, Scientologists or "Moonies." I
don't buy it, and I think it is demeaning to those sincere and thoughtful
individuals who may have embraced religions or philosophies other than those
their parents espoused. It's a cheap way of dismissing their legitimacy and is
tantamount to calling them insane, or in the psychobabble of the day,
"victims."

I'm willing to accept Aaron's assertion at face value that there is a strong
fundamentalist presence in MJ, including multimillion dollar funding. But I
still see no reason to leap from funding and participation to the conclusion
that MJ "was created, supported and run, by fundamentalist Chrsitian church
organizations."

Aaron, like Moshe Shulman in his post, goes on to make the theological case
against MJ, why it is philosophically incompatible with Judaism. Fine. Are
these critics, particluarly among the non-Orthodox, taking the same trouble to
refute all the other "incompatible" components of religions that have been
assimilated into Judaism?

Alaine says,  <<... if, heaven forefend, one of them [her children] wants to
be a messianic Jew, I would tell them that that is an impossibility -- they
can (preferably :-} ) remain as Jews or they can become Christians, they
can't be both.>> 

But would she apply the same logic if the child became a Freudian, a Marxist,
an agnostic, or what the Fundamentalists would call "a liberal humanist"?
Speaking of intellectual honesty (the term came up repeatedly in criticizing
the MJs), doesn't such honesty require us to recognize that all the above
philosophies are just as incompatible with traditional Judaism as Christianity
is?

Alaine suggests a hypothetical situation of a child who adopts Greek
polytheistic beliefs.Here she is getting close to precisely the hypocrisy I
see in the Jewish community regarding MJ. I feel certain that if young Jews
started incorporating Greek polytheism into their Judaism, people would
criticize it, but not nearly with the vehemence and belligerance they direct
at MJ. In fact, elements of polytheistic religions embraced by Reform Judaism
are commonplace nowadays. Our Reform rabbi, for example, routinely chants the
S'hema as a mantra, a device borrowed from polytheistic Hinduism. True, he
doesn't mention Devi, Ganesh and Shiva, but you can bet he wouldn't dare
incorporate Christian content into our ritual, say the Lord's Prayer. Indeed,
some congregation members murmur every so often about crypto-MJs in our
presence! Perhaps we need an auto da fe to extirpate them.

Again, it is Robin Cohen Anderson who gets more to the point, recognizing, "If
my daughter became a Christian she would be met with a great deal of
hostility; if she became a Buddhist, she would not."  Robin seems to resign
herself to the situation: "The reality is that if my daughter became a
Christian, she would be all but ostracized from the Jewish community."

Pragmatic advice, indeed. I suggest that the burden of this child's suffering
would be our responsibility and be rooted largely in our irrational prejudice.

Aaron Rittmaster make one other revealing comment:

> The concept of "Messianic Judaism", which purports to allow one to accept
> Jesus (and Christian scripture) while still being a Jew is contradictory.

Well, of course it's contradictory, but since when do we ostracize Jews for
merely contradicting themselves? My contention is that we only apply
Inquisitorial double standards when it comes to Christian beliefs. Otherwise,
we are benignly tolerant and blissfully multicultural.

Sincerely,
David Howard

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From: Lewis Reich <lbr@sprynet.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 18:40:40 +0000
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

In v6 n109 Eric Simon bravely took up the challenge of dealing with our
moderator's question:

>[Moderator's Note: In my Moderator's Note that introduced this thread, I
>asked if Reform Jews were doing the same thing to Messianics that Orthodox
>Jews often do to Reform....]

and among other incisive things, said:

>To put it more simply: it *is* the Reform position that we *can* draw lines
>(and we do).  So, can't the Orthodox draw lines, too?  Why are Reform's any
>more valid than their's?  Becuase Reform's are wider?

I think Daniel Faigin's question is a useful one, and Eric's response was
excellent.  However, I think both, in focusing on the fact of line drawing,
have missed an essential distinction between the two situations.

Orthodox Jews do not generally deny that adherents of the Reform movement,
because of that affiliation, are not Jews.  (We will leave aside for the
moment the questions regarding conversion and patrilineal descent.)  The may
think that Reform is an "inauthentic" form of Judaism, but they do not rule
Reform Jews in a blanket fashion out of the Jewish community.  Orthodox and
Reform Jews both agree, however, that so-called "Messianic Jews" are not Jews.
Belief in the divinity of Jesus has always been a "bright line" issue.  One
who accepts the divinity of Jesus is a Christian, not a Jew.  If he chooses to
observe parts, or even all of the Torah law, that does not make him a Jew,
only a Torah-observant Christian.

One might argue that acceptance of the principles of halakhah as defined by
the divine origin of the Torah constitute a similar bright line.  It may, but
even if so the line is different.  Accepting the divinity of Jesus renders one
a "mumar", an apostate, one who has changed his/her religion.  Rejecting the
divinity of the Torah or the ultimate authority of traditional halakhah might
render one an "apikoros", a scoffer, but would not mean one was no longer a
Jew.

[Moderator's Note: To the Orthodox, acceptance of anything less than the full
responsibility of mitzvot, or not believing in the Orthodox understanding of
Tanach as the word of God, is an equivalent bright line, even though that line
isn't bright to us in Reform Judaism.  This is what makes the problem so
vexing, and one that may not be solvable. Yet we still must strive to
understand each other. -- DPF]

Lewis Reich

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From: Jerry Blaz <ffdog@earthlink.net>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 19:04:31 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

I am afraid of Messianic Judaism, and I will tell you why.  

I see too much ignorance of Judaism among Jews.  Because I am a liberal Jew,
most of the Jews I see and have contact with are liberal Jews.  Only ignorance
of Judaism can convince someone that Hebrew Christianity or Messianic Judaism
or J4J is anything but Christian.  While I understand that the history of
Reform has some efforts among early Reform leaders that can be construed as
assimilationist, the ability or willingness to assimilate in a given
historical situation has always been extremely subjectively understood.  For
instance, I saw the American Council for Judaism as an assimilationist group.

Now we have a phenomenon where Jews take the "sh'mad" and do not even realize
it.  They believe that they still are Jewish, and this can only be the barren
fruit of Jewish ignorance.  How can they accept the divinity of a human being?
Because they are not really acquainted with the Jewish messianic tradition. So
what is the difference if you are waiting for the arrival of the messiah or
the return of the messiah?  To an ignoramus there is no difference.

What is the difference that Christianity lays on all humans the sin of the
eating of the forbidden fruit in the Garden of Eden, a sin that can only be
wiped out through the blood of Jesus the Christ, or that the Jewish belief
states that evil was let out into the world by disobeying God and eating the
fruit?  The Jewish belief leads to Tikkun Olam(repair of the world).  The
Christian belief leads to baptism and partaking in the Eucharist.  So even a
child is condemned to hell until the child is baptised according to most
Christian belief.

For me, as a Jew, considering all newborns sinners is a theological
abomination but that is no problem for those who don't know their Jewish
tradition. The greatest evil facing Jews, illiberal or otherwise is this
ignorance, and the way Jewish education has failed for the majority of Jews.
(This is a real anomaly when the demographics show child education is the main
reason for synagogue affiliation.)

Mordechai Kaplan's original vision of the American-Jewish community envisaged
communal institutions, and one of them primarly would be the school.  But we
have congregational schools, some Ok, some indifferent, some good, some bad,
so many Jews are not given a proper Jewish education. The results can be seen
in the ignorance of the members of the Jewish community about their Judaism.
Too many Jews have understood the idea of freedom of religion to be ignorance.
An education should not stop but really begin at bar mitzvah.  Judaism is not
an opinion, Jews must gather knowledge, read the books, understand the
contexts in which these books were written, what they meant to the Jews of
different times, and what they can mean to us today. This goal is not only
missing among liberal Jews, but traditional Jews also.

What about traditionalists? They study Jewish texts, and therefore they
believe that they're not ignorant.  However, that is not true, because their
education does not context the composition of a text that they study in the
social conditions in which it was composed.  For the most traditionalists, the
social context of the Shulchan Arukh's composition being a Muslim society
means nothing or even less than nothing to the traditionalist.  So the
Shulchan Arukh's greater stringency is accepted without context.  For me, that
means acceptance without understanding, but accepting it on the authority
coming from God, no less.

The fact remains that many traditional Jews converted to Christianity.  Given
the number of years that Jews have been crossing over to Christianity, and the
comparatively rather brief history of what we call liberal Judaism today, I
can be certain that, in actual numbers, more traditionalists have cross over
than liberal Jews.  The reasons why were not always ignorance, but for the
opportunities the sh'mad entailed.  Rabbis could become Bishops.  Disraeli
became a British Prime Minister. Heine became an honored German poet. And
there were the Pfeffercorns, this is the name I give to a list of rabbis,
etc., who crossed over and became the experts who argued against the Talmud in
the famous disputations between representatives of the Church and the
representatives of the Jewish community as preludes to persecutions, pogroms,
and expulsions.  Pfeffercorn is the actual name of one of the most notorious
of them.

Often, when we are attacked for our Jewishness, we become very willing to make
it our cause celebre.  But when we become too comfortable in our Judaism, it
loses its importance to us, and when acceptance and tolerance towards Jews is
strong, many of us devalue our Judaism and carry it on our arm. This seems to
be a justification for ignorance.  This is the sin of the liberal Jew, IMHO,
but there are other ignorances.  I believe that the substitution of authority
for knowledge is just as serious.

Jerry

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From: Ruth Levenstein <RuthEllenL@aol.com>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 22:23:31 -0500
Subject: Re: Who's Afraid of Messianic Judaism and Why?

David Howard asked: "Why do we see such hostility expressed toward
self-proclaimed Jewish Christians instead of dialogue and outreach?"

I'd like to have a go at this.  Others have done a good job of both at
expressing and explaining the hostility.  I'd like to tackle the issue of
dialogue and outreach with Messianic Jew's.

The assumption has been that Reform Judaism is in some kind of catch-22.
Either they accept MJ as a legitimate expression of Judaism, or they have to
give up their ideal of respecting individual choices.  The implication is that
MJ's have pushed that ideal to the extreme.  This could not be further from
the truth.  MJ is an authority, truth-based religious system.  Jews who become
MJ's have not only converted from Judaism to Christianity, they have also
adopted an authoritarian approach to religion.

Dialog between Reform Jews and MJ's would be almost impossible because these
groups have vastly different approaches to religion.  MJ's would want to
examine scripture and relate their personal experiences all with the
assumption that this will help to reveal the ultimate truth.  Reform Jews
would say that truth is subjective and very personal.  Orthodox Judaism would
have better luck dialoging with MJ's as they could at least agree on the
search for the one authentic expression of Judaism through study.  It sounds
like the group Jew's for Judaism does this by addressing MJ on their own
terms.

Those who are attracted to MJ or other evangelical Christian groups are
generally seeking a certainty that liberal religion does not offer.  Their
needs would best be met within Judaism (as many have already stated) by
knowledge of and access to serious traditional Jews.  However if their need is
to be part of the larger society their only option within Judaism is to make
alliah. (unlikely !)

As an aside, there certainly are Jews who leave Judaism for a liberal brand of
Christianity.  (Check out Unitarian and Congregational churches across the
country.)  These needs could perhaps be met within Judaism by vibrant and
accessible liberal Jewish movements.  (Reform, Reconstuctionist, Jewish
Renewal, and Humanistic Judaism)

In either case the cost of leaving Judaism is loss of community.  (One does
not have to be excommunicated to experience this.)  The fact is, if you move
beyond the boundaries of your group, as defined by the group, then you will
need to seek out others like yourself and commune with them. (pun intended!)
And that is exactly what happens in both instances.

Ruth Levenstein    

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From: Lawrence Raphael <raphael@is3.nyu.edu>
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 06:48:43 -0800
Subject: Announcement: Reform Judaism Winter Retreat

We are pleased to announce to subscribers to Liberal Judaism that the Union of
American Hebrew Congregations and Hebrew Union College-Jewish Institute of
Religion is sponsoring a Spirituality and Study Retreat in West Palm Beach
Florida, March 6-9, 1997.

If any of you are interested in further information, send a note to our email
address, ajgrowth@uahc.org.

Rabbi Larry Raphael (UAHC)
Rabbi Kerry Olitzky (HUC-JIR)

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"It is not our task as liberal Jews to complain about the Orthodox attitude or to be bullied by it, but rather to choose our legitimate path according to the inner logic and development of liberal Judaism" (Rabbi Walter Jacob)

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